ARE 331 Discussion

[Pam Stephens]

Chapter Leaders, please post your questions here.

[Candace Conwell]

I am not a chapter leader for chapter 10, but I was wondering if anyone else had an opinion about what Eisner says on page 234-235, #7 "The arts should be justified in education primarily in relation to their distinctive or unique educational contributions". I heartily agree with everything he says here on these pages, but it seems contradictory to what I felt he was saying in the last chapter, that somehow the arts need justification in other subjects......am I the only one that got a confusing message from his writing?

[Pam Stephens]

Eisner's overall message is that the arts are rigorous and should be taught for their innate ability to develop critical thinking skills that children do not always experience in other content areas. I'll need to re-read the chapter to respond to your question about contradiction.

Do you feel the entire chapter poses a contradiction or just a certain passage? Help me.

[Devin Smith]

I feel like I've learned a lot from Eisner but where he stands on certain issues isn't always clear to me either. I was also confused.

[Pam Stephens]

From the speeches I have heard Eisner give, he is an adamant supporter of art in the curriculum simply because the content is worth teaching. I believe (but could be wrong) that Eisner shuns the arts as a support system, although he recognizes the importance of art in other content areas. His ultimate school situtation would have art in every classroom with every teacher (specialists and generalists alike) teaching art as a meaningful subject that threads through the entire curriculum.

[Laura Pontel]

I don't think that he was meaning that art educators need to justify what the arts teach in other subjects, rather that the arts should be on the same playing field as the other subjects, "to seek justifications for the teaching of the arts in terms that the general public values." I think he is just restating that we are always going to have to show that the arts are just as important as the other subjects and that we need to show this to parents and other teachers.

[Pam Stephens]

Laura, I think you have it.

Our perception of art teaching is often different from the perception that the public holds. from thatr standpoint, we art teachers are constantly having to defend our actions and programs.

[Devin Smith]

What about justifying art by saying that it lowers truancy rates or that it encourages critical thinking? Eisner says that the arts should be justified with contributions that are distinctive to the arts, but couldn't those reasons be used to justify any other subject? If a kid really liked math but hated all other subjects, might he feel motivated to come to school just for that?

[Rachel Richards]

I sometimes get confused too and I have to read and reread. I guess I took it as meaning that the arts have "distinctive or unique educatonal contributions" that overflow to other subjects. I could be wrong. It's just what I got from it.

[Pam Stephens]

Devin is right. A kid who likes a subject will go to school for that subject whether it is art, math, or anything.

What Eisner upholds is the ideal that art shouldn't be in the curriculum to keep kids in school. Isn't that making art the handmaiden?

Art should be in the curriculum because art should be in the curriculum. It is a worthy course of study.

[Joan Agundez]

Just as the article in the NAEA paper that I brought to class said, "The arts develop 8 qualities that are not developed in other subjects and those occur by habits developed in art studio activities"....a few are exercising ones ability to 'see', to be perisistant, to explore and to experiment, to not be discouraged and to widen ones viewpoint. Increasing these ablilities helps students to also relate things they learn to the world they live in.

When students are engaged and are increasing these abilities, this relates to other areas and subjects because it is a holistic activity that raises the 'awareness' of the student and operates like the velcro to hook and loop information to the student so they can understand, retain and use their other subjects in school.

[Pam Stephens]

In other words, it is a natural connection.

[Laura Hansen]

I don't think he was saying "art's unique educational contributions" to other subjects but to the learning experience in general. So I don't feel that he was being contradictory although I will agree that there are times when Eisner seems quite vague.,